mersenneforum.org Lingua Latina sive in alia verba, " the Latin language"
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2021-12-31, 16:23   #56
Uncwilly
6809 > 6502

"""""""""""""""""""
Aug 2003
101×103 Posts

24×32×73 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Dr Sardonicus I have often noticed, on this Forum and elsewhere, the practice of using gratuitously arcane jargon. In some cases, this appears to be aimed at adopting an air of superiority over those who simply don't know the jargon, regardless of how well they may understand the underlying concepts. In other cases, it seems to be aimed at disguising the mundane nature of what they are presenting.
That is common in some industries. It is also a centuries old practice at some learning institutions. It helps to reinforce an us vs them mentality.

2021-12-31, 17:52   #57
xilman
Bamboozled!

"𒉺𒌌𒇷𒆷𒀭"
May 2003
Down not across

22×3×941 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Uncwilly That is common in some industries. It is also a centuries old practice at some learning institutions. It helps to reinforce an us vs them mentality.
The priests have been using the technique for many millennia, almost certainly long before any surviving records.

2022-01-04, 03:03   #58
jwaltos

Apr 2012
Oh oh.

11×41 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Dr Sardonicus I have tried to render this into a Latin phrase modeled on the above quotation. I fear I may have botched the grammar. Could somebody who knows Latin please check the following, and indicate any necessary corrections? I have seen "Nil" rendered as "Nihil" in some renderings of the quotation from Petrarch. Nil sapientiae odiosius obsuritate nimia
https://scholarlycommons.pacific.edu...=PDFCoverPages
I recently came upon the above and a couple of allied sites where I'm learning from the master..math as well as latin, perhaps if you send an email there requesting a translation they may help. I'm not familiar with any Latin "dialects" where both instances may be correct relative to the context.

I had read some history regarding Paracelcus recalling a passage attributed to him where he stated that the medical profession spoke Latin in order that the general populace would not understand what was being communicated.
In order to resolve some of these methods of communication I use my "looking glass" and consider such information transfer as encoded relative to some context where the content is both explicit and implicit. For example, when reading a newspaper (online or not) you can recognize vanity press, favoured perspectives and bias, secret communications (occasionally) within the classifieds. And then there are riddles, https://www.ams.org/journals/mcom/19...-1197512-7.pdf

Last fiddled with by jwaltos on 2022-01-04 at 03:23

2022-01-09, 18:31   #59
BudgieJane

"Jane Sullivan"
Jan 2011
Beckenham, UK

2×3×72 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Dr Sardonicus There is a quotation, often misattributed to Seneca (See e.g. the epigraph to Edgar Allan Poe's story The Purloined Letter) but, apparently actually due to Petrarch (De Remediis utriusque Fortunae): Nil sapientiae odiosius acumine nimio [Nothing is more hateful to wisdom that excessive cleverness] I have often noticed, on this Forum and elsewhere, the practice of using gratuitously arcane jargon. In some cases, this appears to be aimed at adopting an air of superiority over those who simply don't know the jargon, regardless of how well they may understand the underlying concepts. In other cases, it seems to be aimed at disguising the mundane nature of what they are presenting. This led me to think of a slightly different sentiment than the above, "There is noting more hateful to wisdom than excessive obscurity." I have tried to render this into a Latin phrase modeled on the above quotation. I fear I may have botched the grammar. Could somebody who knows Latin please check the following, and indicate any necessary corrections? I have seen "Nil" rendered as "Nihil" in some renderings of the quotation from Petrarch. Nil sapientiae odiosius obsuritate nimia
You omitted the "c" from obscuritate: Nil sapientiae odiosius obscuritate nimia.

2022-01-09, 23:52   #60
Dr Sardonicus

Feb 2017
Nowhere

10110100010002 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by BudgieJane You omitted the "c" from obscuritate: Nil sapientiae odiosius obscuritate nimia.
Mea culpa.

Another post, another typo...

 2022-02-16, 12:50 #61 MattcAnderson     "Matthew Anderson" Dec 2010 Oregon, USA 3·367 Posts from jwaltos (page 5) Code: 千里之行，始于足下_百度百科 Milia passuum itinere uno gradu incipit ...praesertim cum pereunt. Lost in (google latin) translation: A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step..especially when you're lost. We try not to be lost. (At least I do.) Regards, Matt Last fiddled with by MattcAnderson on 2022-02-16 at 12:52 Reason: gave credit
2022-02-17, 16:47   #62
BudgieJane

"Jane Sullivan"
Jan 2011
Beckenham, UK

2×3×72 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by MattcAnderson from jwaltos (page 5) Code: 千里之行，始于足下_百度百科 Milia passuum itinere uno gradu incipit ...praesertim cum pereunt. Lost in (google latin) translation: A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step..especially when you're lost. We try not to be lost. (At least I do.) Regards, Matt
It certainly was lost in the translation: The Latin presented above sort-of translates as "A journey of a mile begins with a single step ...", not a thousand miles. But "itinere" is in the wrong case; it is the ablative, so it actually translates as "with a journey" which is nonsensical, and for the subject of the verb "incipit" ("begins") you need "a journey" ("iter"), i.e. the nominative is required.

For your translation, the Latin should start "Mille milia passuum iter uno gradu incipit ..."

BTW, be very wary of Google Translate; it does not do foreign languages very well. Languages I have had trouble with include German and Latin. In particular, it cannot translate words that have two or more completely different meanings, and it will not allow you to select which meaning you want to use for a particular occurrence of that word.

2022-02-17, 17:18   #63
Dr Sardonicus

Feb 2017
Nowhere

23·7·103 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by BudgieJane For your translation, the Latin should start "Mille milia passuum iter uno gradu incipit ..."
A similar sentiment is "Great oaks, from little acorns grow." A transmogrified rendition is, "Great aches, from little toe corns grow."

2022-02-17, 18:47   #64
xilman
Bamboozled!

"𒉺𒌌𒇷𒆷𒀭"
May 2003
Down not across

22·3·941 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by BudgieJane It certainly was lost in the translation: The Latin presented above sort-of translates as "A journey of a mile begins with a single step ...", not a thousand miles. But "itinere" is in the wrong case; it is the ablative, so it actually translates as "with a journey" which is nonsensical, and for the subject of the verb "incipit" ("begins") you need "a journey" ("iter"), i.e. the nominative is required. For your translation, the Latin should start "Mille milia passuum iter uno gradu incipit ..." BTW, be very wary of Google Translate; it does not do foreign languages very well. Languages I have had trouble with include German and Latin. In particular, it cannot translate words that have two or more completely different meanings, and it will not allow you to select which meaning you want to use for a particular occurrence of that word.
I have been bitten by Google Translate many times. Most of the time it doesn't matter too much because the intended meaning is understood by the reader, either immediately or on the subsequent iteration. Caveat lector.

Sic biscuitus disintegrat!

(FWIW, I tend to translate into a language and then back into English, sometimes via a non-Indoeuropean language such as Arabic or Korean. That often points to areas which require attention.)

2022-02-17, 18:49   #65
xilman
Bamboozled!

"𒉺𒌌𒇷𒆷𒀭"
May 2003
Down not across

22×3×941 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Dr Sardonicus A similar sentiment is "Great oaks, from little acorns grow." A transmogrified rendition is, "Great aches, from little toe corns grow."
Chronometrez-vous les mouches comme une flèche.

8-)

2022-02-17, 19:43   #66
Batalov

"Serge"
Mar 2008
Phi(4,2^7658614+1)/2

7×23×61 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by xilman Chronometrez-vous les mouches comme une flèche. 8-)
"Les mouches des fruits plaire banane."

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