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Old 2012-11-06, 22:04   #1
Raman
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Default Black's sixth move

okay with
6...e6
6...Rb8
6...f5
6...Nh6[COLOR=White] n.o.[/COLOR]
6...Bd7[COLOR=White] n.o.[/COLOR]
6...Nf6[COLOR=White] n.o.[/COLOR]
6...e5[COLOR=White] n.o.[/COLOR]
6...b6[COLOR=White] n.o.[/COLOR]
Everytime I will have to start with this new thread right into this following forum?
Better you will yourself subscribe into [URL="http://mersenneforum.org/showthread.php?t=17256"]this following[/URL] thread itself, for the in order to get with the notifications by using the e-mails processes itself automatically, right then, okay all right then
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Old 2012-11-07, 00:01   #2
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I just don't consider myself capable of creating a list of reasonable moves, so I wait for someone (usually you :razz:) to make such a list. (I can't make a choice right now, but perhaps in a few hours.)
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Old 2012-11-07, 15:23   #3
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[QUOTE=Dubslow;317297]I just don't consider myself capable of creating a list of reasonable moves, so I wait for someone (usually you :razz:) to make such a list. (I can't make a choice right now, but perhaps in a few hours.)[/QUOTE]

I'll be back in a while to look at the full set of moves that come to mind.
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Old 2012-11-08, 00:34   #4
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e5 would probably by the best move I've seen I'll go with it.
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Old 2012-11-08, 16:36   #5
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[B]6...Nh6[/B] - this is bad, if black o-o, that horse is lost after pushing the g/h columns and/or does not really participate to the game. In this respect, [B]6...f5[/B] is bad too, after Nf3 he really gets advantage on the center-right, we can't move the N elsewhere except h6 to do o-o, and I think he even can do better Nge2 or Be3, becoming really strong there.

[B]6...Bd7[/B] - bit better, but does not participate to the game, the white B from f1 is gone, so there is no threat in b5. Moreover, the white still has the control in the center, and the black gets no hit into d5 square. After white pushes the a/b pawns this move seems lost, or at least a "waiting" move. Maybe[B] 6..Be6[/B] (my addition, not in the former list) would look much better here, if we really have to move the B from c8 (do we? I did not see too many sicilian defenses with the big o-o-o).

[B]6...b6[/B] / [B]6...Rb8[/B] - again waiting moves. What are they good for? White can't push that column without losing the horse in c3 first, so the column b is "safe" for now.[B][COLOR=Red] Don't give him the "[URL="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Go_terms#Gote_and_Sente"]sente[/URL]"[/COLOR][/B]. We got the sente after his f4 move, lets' keep it. I think our goal would be to cover d5 so he would need to lose two moves to move the queen and put the horse in d1 (he MUST move that horse from there, its position is very weak and stops him to develop) before moving it into the right side of the board. Now he has the "escape" in d5. This is "central" too, we don't have to give up fighting for the center of the board yet.

[B]6...e5[/B] after some big exchanges of the lumber in the center we lose any advantage we may have. Wasn't that his intention when he moved f4? Additionally, if we move the pawn in column e so advanced, there is no way anymore to scary his knight in d5. This is not the best we can do.

[B]6...Nf6[/B] / [B]6...e6[/B] this is how we need to go. We keep d5 under control. Between these two, I would like the pawn better, keeping the bishop diagonal open (and avoiding tempting him with an exchange of the horses if he moves Nd5).
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Old 2012-11-08, 19:57   #6
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Yeah, I don't like e5 either, they could put us in a real awkward position by pushing f5. I think I'll agree with e6. (Nf6 seems like a bad idea to me.)
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Old 2012-11-08, 20:55   #7
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okay with
6...e6 move
But what about moves around with, such as like 6...Bxc3:question: :razz:[COLOR=White] 6...Bxf3[/COLOR]
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Old 2012-11-09, 15:23   #8
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In my previous post, in the first paragraph, when I said [B]"6...f5[/B] is bad too", I mistakenly put the pawn in [B]f6[/B] instead of f5, that is why I said "we can't move the knight except on h6". So, it should really read as "[B]6...f6[/B] is bad too because bla bla bla".

However this does not change anything, [B]6...f5 [/B]is even worse, that is why I even did not consider it in analysis. The white is not stupid to fall for the trap, and he will not bite, he can move something else, so we will be forced later to take its pawn in e4 to release the line for the bishop in c8, and after taking e4 with its d3, he will have two very strong pawns there and all the center is his.

[QUOTE=Raman;317595]okay with
6...e6 move
But what about moves around with, such as like 6...Bxc3[/QUOTE]
That version would let us with the same dilemma, what do we move after he takes the bishop b3xc3? we give him the b column totally, as he can move the rock to b1, and he gets stronger on b4 and d4 squares by capturing the bishop in c3. In fact, after he captures it, our only reasonable move would be Rb8, but still difficult to regain the lost center.

Still thinking [B]6...e6[/B] is the best. (edit: and after his 7.Nf3 we do 7...Ne7, and we are very good in the center, then 0-0 and 0-0, and we are out of the opening phase for good :razz:)

Last fiddled with by LaurV on 2012-11-09 at 15:37
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Old 2012-11-09, 18:19   #9
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okay with
6...e6 move
But what about following with moves around with, such as like 6...Bxc3 :question: :razz:[COLOR=White] 6...Bxf3[/COLOR]
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Old 2012-11-09, 18:33   #10
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The other appropriate options are being
6...Nd4
6...h6
6...Qa5 (against 7.Bd2)
6...Be6
6.Nf3 Bg4
[STRIKE]6...Bf5[/STRIKE]
6...Qd7
6...Qc7
6...Qb6
6...a6
6...a5
6...h5
[STRIKE]6...b5[/STRIKE]
[STRIKE]6...[B]f6[/B][/STRIKE]
moves
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Old 2012-11-09, 18:47   #11
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[CODE]1)Rb8
2)a6
3)a5
4)b6
5)b5
6)c4
7)d5
8)e6
9)e5
10)f6
11)f5
12)g5
13)h6
14)h5
15)Nb8
16)Na5
17)Nb4
18)Nd4
19)Ne5
20)Bd7
21)Be6
22)Bf5
23)Bg4
24)Bh3
25)Qc7
26)Qb6
27)Qa5
28)Qd7
29)Kd7
30)Kf8
31)Bf6
32)Be5
33)Bd4
34)Bxc3
35)Nf6
36)Nh6[/CODE]

the full list that I can see a lot of these set up pieces to be captured Nb8 stops the possibility of a queen side castle later. Qd7 aligns to create a way for them to take a piece. now to find one that doesn't destroy us.
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