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2021-06-09, 18:03   #45
storm5510
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Aug 2009

1,987 Posts

Quote:
 Originally Posted by LaurV ...(like, you pose to have no idea if they are correct, but you know very well that this is a can of worms... typical troll).

I am not a troll. In my experience, a "troll" is someone who has little or nothing to offer and tries to offend others by behaving improperly. If nothing else, I try to be civil.

Attached is the image of the 39 hard drive setup I mentioned. He did a good job of arranging it all neatly, but was not forthcoming about going into a lot of detail about it. He did mention he has had 4 hits since starting. He is probably a long way from ROI though.

Quote:
 Originally Posted by lavalamp Based on the number of plots and SMART data, my drives are averaging just shy of 1.4 TiB written per plot. Though I am also using 64 buckets instead of the default 128 to reduce reads,
Buckets?

Quote:
 Originally Posted by mackerel I was estimating on the magnitude of one hit a year. For the cost of running some old HDs, that's not a bad return.
I have never measured one of my setups under a moderate load without using a GPU. My i7 used to idle at 105W, before I replaced the HD with an SSD. When I run Prime95, this jumps to about 180W. Of course, there is very little drive activity. If I ran it this way for a full year, nonstop, the electrical cost would be just above $200. This is way below what I would have guessed. Attached Thumbnails 2021-06-09, 18:09 #46 chalsall If I May "Chris Halsall" Sep 2002 Barbados 23·5·251 Posts Quote:  Originally Posted by lavalamp I suppose it's not too bad as long as you know what you're buying, but still a staggeringly large portion of people believe they're losing more than whole terabytes now due to "ugh, windows formatting just does that." caveat emptor. Those who /do/ know what they're doing will sometimes "undersubscribe" their SSDs intentionally, depending on the use-case and risk-mitigation strategy. 2021-06-09, 18:58 #47 M344587487 "Composite as Heck" Oct 2017 2·3·5·29 Posts Quote:  Originally Posted by chalsall caveat emptor. Those who /do/ know what they're doing will sometimes "undersubscribe" their SSDs intentionally, depending on the use-case and risk-mitigation strategy. There's probably a big overlap between intentional undersubscription and Linux 102: separation of root and home. I guess old folks will also make a point of making a swap partition. IMO if root needs more than 32GiB you're doing it wrong. 2021-06-10, 01:34 #48 storm5510 Random Account Aug 2009 1,987 Posts Quote:  Originally Posted by lavalamp ...I suppose it's not too bad as long as you know what you're buying, but still a staggeringly large portion of people believe they're losing more than whole terabytes now due to "ugh, windows formatting just does that." How, exactly, does Windows formatting, or any other, do this? I have one Samsung 970 EVO 250 GB SSD. One partition or volume or whatever you want to call it. The maximum capacity of the partition is 250 billion bytes and a lot of change. There is no visible loss. "Undersubscribed." For the record, I searched the web for over 30 minutes and found nothing relative to the size/capacity of SSD's, beyond one item which says an SSD with x advertised bytes can actually be x*3 bytes. I cannot see corporate types giving away free space. This makes less sense than my cat eating sawdust. 2021-06-10, 02:46 #49 lavalamp Oct 2007 Manchester, UK 2×3×227 Posts Quote:  Originally Posted by storm5510 How, exactly, does Windows formatting, or any other, do this? We've been over this. Quote:  Originally Posted by storm5510 Some are insisting that 1 TB is equal to 1000^4 bytes and 1 TiB is 1024^4 bytes. Last fiddled with by lavalamp on 2021-06-10 at 02:46 2021-06-10, 14:30 #50 chalsall If I May "Chris Halsall" Sep 2002 Barbados 23×5×251 Posts Quote:  Originally Posted by storm5510 "Undersubscribed." For the record, I searched the web for over 30 minutes and found nothing relative to the size/capacity of SSD's... Depending on the use case (for example, a drive that will be experiencing a non-nominal amount of writes) there can be an advantage by not fully allocating the drive into partitions. This leaves additional capacity available for the device to swap out bad sectors. This isn't as important nowadays as it once was. But it doesn't hurt (other than the "loss" of capacity, of course). 2021-06-10, 14:33 #51 chalsall If I May "Chris Halsall" Sep 2002 Barbados 23·5·251 Posts Quote:  Originally Posted by M344587487 IMO if root needs more than 32GiB you're doing it wrong. Agreed, with the exception of /var -- MariaDB can grow quite big sometimes. 2021-06-10, 15:59 #52 PhilF "6800 descendent" Feb 2005 Colorado 2×11×31 Posts Quote:  Originally Posted by chalsall Depending on the use case (for example, a drive that will be experiencing a non-nominal amount of writes) there can be an advantage by not fully allocating the drive into partitions. This leaves additional capacity available for the device to swap out bad sectors. This isn't as important nowadays as it once was. But it doesn't hurt (other than the "loss" of capacity, of course). That's called under provisioning, and is a common practice. It isn't so much that the unallocated space is available for bad sectors that's important, it is more for wear leveling. Wear leveling helps to prevent bad sectors from forming in the first place. https://www.anandtech.com/show/6489/playing-with-op Last fiddled with by PhilF on 2021-06-10 at 16:06 Reason: Added link to over/under provisioning for the geeks 2021-06-10, 16:37 #53 chalsall If I May "Chris Halsall" Sep 2002 Barbados 234708 Posts Quote:  Originally Posted by PhilF That's called under provisioning... Thank you for the correction of the nomenclature. And for the link. Sincerely. If you can't name something, you can't control it! 8-) 2021-06-10, 17:17 #54 storm5510 Random Account Aug 2009 1,987 Posts Quote:  Originally Posted by chalsall Depending on the use case (for example, a drive that will be experiencing a non-nominal amount of writes) there can be an advantage by not fully allocating the drive into partitions. This leaves additional capacity available for the device to swap out bad sectors. This isn't as important nowadays as it once was. But it doesn't hurt (other than the "loss" of capacity, of course). Clear as crystal. Thank you! I read something a few days ago which indicated that SSD's reserve about 7% of their capacity for use as needed by the drive. Whether this applies to all makes, it did not say, but seems logical. They need something for reallocation, like mechanical types have done for a long time. Quote:  Originally Posted by lavalamp We've been over this. I will take your word for it. My memory is not what it used to be.  2021-06-11, 17:14 #55 storm5510 Random Account Aug 2009 1,987 Posts An image I lifted from Reddit. A guy bragging about buying 20 of these. They are 18TB Seagate Enterprise drives. Amazon's price is$749 each. He didn't say where he got these. If he were to have gotten them from Amazon, he would have paid nearly \$15K for the group. Absolute lunacy. IMO, this mass-purchasing by private individuals needs to be stopped cold. Only large commercial and industrial interests having business licenses should have access to bulk purchasing. Attached Thumbnails

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