![]() |
![]() |
#23 | |
P90 years forever!
Aug 2002
Yeehaw, FL
23×1,019 Posts |
![]()
Cheesehead, I've not fundamentally opposed anything you've said. Many Republicans in leadership positions have abused the scientific method. My point of contention is that by framing the debate as the "Republican War on Science", it implies that most or all Republicans are of that mind-set and/or that the Democrats are the party of truth and logic. Neither implication is correct.
Zeta, I don't have the links handy, but the Bush administration has instituted a policy where scientific studies are reviewed by political appointees before being published or presented at conferences. These political types look for conclusions that are contrary to administration policy and then water down the conclusions - such as replacing "clearly shows" with "could be construed" and then suggesting further research. The global warming scientist cheesehead referred to is the most well-known victim of this policy. Quote:
Cheesehead, you've left out one of my favorites: Star Wars. The science shows that the current systems will not be very effective, yet there is a strong push to build it based on one or two rather contrived test launches. |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#24 |
May 2003
7×13×17 Posts |
![]()
Which scientific studies? Which political appointees? Which conferences?
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#25 |
"Phil"
Sep 2002
Tracktown, U.S.A.
25×5×7 Posts |
![]()
James Hansen is the NASA scientist (educated at the University of Iowa) who claimed that attempts were made to limit his contacts with the media:
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/29/sc...pagewanted=all The other prominent example is Philip Cooney, who admitted editing scientific reports on March 20 in testimony before a Congressional committee. "My sole loyalty was to the President and advancing the policies of his administration," he is quoted as saying. This 2005 article gives more details on Cooney's activities when he served as chief of staff for the White House Council on Environmental Quality: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/08/po...0731d8&ei=5090 A former oil industry lobbyist, Cooney resigned a few days after this article was published and has worked for Exxon-Mobil since then. |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#26 | |
"Richard B. Woods"
Aug 2002
Wisconsin USA
22×3×641 Posts |
![]() Quote:
The "more than sixty" part is false, and any competent stem cell researcher would have told Bush that the actual number was insufficient for research, _if_ Bush were interested in the truth about it. He gave the false impression that there were enough cell lines for research already existing so that more (from embryos) were unnecessary, and it's anti-science whether he was ignorant (because he didn't bother getting correct advice) or not (and therefore he was deceptive). Did Bush issue a correction, and reconsider the decision, after being informed of the discrepancy ... as one might expect in the case of simple ignorance? This item is planned to appear in the grand amalgamated info I'm preparing for this thread. Last fiddled with by cheesehead on 2007-04-04 at 08:24 |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#27 | ||||
"Richard B. Woods"
Aug 2002
Wisconsin USA
22×3×641 Posts |
![]() Quote:
Meanwhile, peruse "The A to Z Guide to Political Interference in Science", the Union of Concerned Scientists' take at http://www.ucsusa.org/scientific_int...political.html. Let me know the ratio of Dems' misdeeds listed there compared to Repubs', if you wish. (I haven't counted.) Quote:
Or did I miss some anguished cry from the Republican party masses about this issue? Quote:
Quote:
Last fiddled with by cheesehead on 2007-04-04 at 08:34 |
||||
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#28 | ||
"Richard B. Woods"
Aug 2002
Wisconsin USA
1E0C16 Posts |
![]()
"Obama Administration Follows UCS Recommendations to Protect Scientific Integrity"
("UCS" = Union of Concerned Scientists) http://www.ucsusa.org/news/press_rel...lows-0205.html Quote:
The memorandum: http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/Memorandum-for-the-Heads-of-Executive-Departments-and-Agencies-3-9-09/ Quote:
Last fiddled with by cheesehead on 2009-03-11 at 08:43 |
||
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#29 | |
"Richard B. Woods"
Aug 2002
Wisconsin USA
22×3×641 Posts |
![]()
For those who haven't followed the link in post #27 to "The A to Z Guide to Political Interference in Science", here's just one example (linked from the M box at right side of the "periodic table"'s second row) of a Bush administration policy (which Dr. Drew Shindell called “a measure unbefitting a democratic society.”)
http://www.ucsusa.org/scientific_int...quired-at.html Quote:
Last fiddled with by cheesehead on 2009-03-11 at 09:03 |
|
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#30 | |||
"Richard B. Woods"
Aug 2002
Wisconsin USA
22·3·641 Posts |
![]() Quote:
U.S. Department of the Interior Press Release "Salazar Issues Secretarial Order to Ensure Integrity of Scientific Process in Departmental Decision-Making" http://www.doi.gov/news/pressrelease...ion-Making.cfm Quote:
Quote:
If Democrat really and truly had previously been just as abusive of science as Republicans, as you seem desperately to want to claim, then why didn't Republicans issue such orders to stop political interference in scientific matters when they were in power? If the Democratic abuses really and truly existed so significantly as you claim, why in the world would Republicans refrain from ordering a clear and comprehensive stop to political interference with science -- if Republicans understood and defended the basic principles of science, that is? The evidence is clear; it was -- and still is -- overwhelmingly the Republican side of the aisle that tries to deny and distort science for political purposes. The current Republican wall of universal AGW denials by candidates running for election this fall is just the latest demonstration of mass ignorance, and willing distortion, of science (not to mention susceptibility to fossil-fuel company propaganda) by so many people who have a conservative worldview. Let me explain that I'm not saying the conservative worldview is false; I'm saying that the conservative worldview starts out okay, but has the unfortunate weakness of lending itself to purveyors of mass delusions such as that the conservative worldview is the only valid worldview, that non-conservatives are morally inferior to conservatives, and that science must bow to religion or to political goals when there's a conflict. The conservative side has a valid place in society, but needs to rid itself of such delusions. Last fiddled with by cheesehead on 2010-10-06 at 18:54 |
|||
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#31 |
Aug 2002
Termonfeckin, IE
AD016 Posts |
![]()
Well, to be fair, one of the news stories today is how the Obama administration blocked scientists from reporting worst-case figures for the spill. So they are not as saintly as you are making them out. But still they are a lot lot better than Bush 2.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101006/...gulf_oil_spill |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#32 |
Aug 2006
598710 Posts |
![]()
I don't understand the argument here. Why wasn't it proposed twelve years earlier, during the Clinton administration? Why not twenty years earlier, or thirty? The same can be said for any bill or proposal. "We didn't get around to it", "we didn't have the political capital", and "we hadn't thought of it" are pretty usual occurrences.
Last fiddled with by CRGreathouse on 2010-10-06 at 21:33 |
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
#33 | |||
"Richard B. Woods"
Aug 2002
Wisconsin USA
22·3·641 Posts |
![]() Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
|
|||
![]() |
![]() |
![]() |
Thread Tools | |
![]() |
||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Recommended Science Fiction Reading | Flatlander | Hobbies | 79 | 2022-11-04 15:24 |
For science! | firejuggler | Soap Box | 11 | 2013-10-25 06:24 |
Actuarial Science | kakos22 | Information & Answers | 0 | 2010-07-22 19:06 |
Rabies for the Republican Party | cheesehead | Soap Box | 140 | 2009-09-10 22:29 |
Science History Link | Spherical Cow | Science & Technology | 1 | 2006-11-13 10:16 |