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Old 2021-04-22, 17:18   #1
storm5510
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Default A Change Of Mind

A few weeks ago, I decided I was going to take an extended break from this forum. I purged all my subscribed threads and cleared my private messages. I felt I was no longer able to participate in a meaningful way. It is true that I understand little about the math, but far more than I did a decade ago.

I have recently thought about my days with MS-DOS back in the late 1980's and how easy it was for me to learn. I can say the same for all the Windows variants since. Many here like to look down their noses at Windows users. The same can be said of Linux users. I can easily spot the differences in topics and stay away from Linux content.

So, I will return on a "trial" basis and see how it goes. I stayed away for three years a decade ago. I will limit my contributions so I do not incur the wrath of a few. That is all.
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Old 2021-04-22, 20:59   #2
Nick
 
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The Windows versus Linux discussion often becomes heated but I thought this time that people managed
on the whole to be critical of the other technology without attacking its users personally.
If you feel you have "incurred the wrath of a few" again in the future, please feel free to
report the relevant post(s) via the triangle-with-exclamation-mark.
We like to keep each other's wits sharp on this forum but it should be with respect for everyone!
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Old 2021-04-22, 23:38   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick View Post
The Windows versus Linux discussion often becomes heated but I thought this time that people managed
on the whole to be critical of the other technology without attacking its users personally.
If you feel you have "incurred the wrath of a few" again in the future, please feel free to
report the relevant post(s) via the triangle-with-exclamation-mark.
We like to keep each other's wits sharp on this forum but it should be with respect for everyone!
I have been aware of the red triangle, but never thought of using it before. I noticed something recently which I had not been aware of previously, the "Ignore List." I have already added one member who always attempted to highlight my perceived ignorance about most things. I ended up doing a public dressing-down of his statements not long ago. There has been no badgering since.
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Old 2021-04-23, 02:51   #4
LaurV
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Quote:
Originally Posted by storm5510 View Post
back in the late 1980's and how easy it was for me to learn
That goes for us all. I don't think is related to MS-Dos or Windows. It is called "aging". Here being a DOS/Windows user and programmer for close to 40 years, making a living of it, and had some Linux courses in the Uni (2 semesters, actually, that was like 35 years ago too), and never used it for more than trifles ever since, and I still suck at it. And I am not afraid, neither ashamed to say it. Our force, as a group, stays in the fact that we are different. Some excel in domains where others suck, and vice-versa. And we can help each-other, if we have a positive attitude about it.

Last fiddled with by LaurV on 2021-04-23 at 02:52
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Old 2021-04-23, 10:39   #5
xilman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick View Post
The Windows versus Linux discussion often becomes heated but I thought this time that people managed
on the whole to be critical of the other technology without attacking its users personally.
If you feel you have "incurred the wrath of a few" again in the future, please feel free to
report the relevant post(s) via the triangle-with-exclamation-mark.
We like to keep each other's wits sharp on this forum but it should be with respect for everyone!
Religious arguments can be great fun as long as no-one takes it personally.

Something I learned many years ago: take note of your opponents' arguments. Next time someone is espousing your favourite system take up the opposite position and use your learning against them.

More generally: a Devil's Advocate is an extremely useful function. Pay attention to them and learn how to become one yourself.
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Old 2021-04-23, 12:55   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xilman View Post
. . .
More generally: a Devil's Advocate is an extremely useful function. Pay attention to them and learn how to become one yourself.
I remember going to a meeting that was scheduled to find reasons to keep one of our sections local. After hearing the proposal we were to oppose, I said something to the effect that it seemed quite apparent that the other entity was much more capable of performing the needed task and maybe we should accept that route. Boy, was I popular!

My boss stepped in and suggested that my "Devil's Advocacy" would help us look at the areas we could work on to bring our local section up to the other's level.
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Old 2021-04-23, 16:24   #7
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My boss stepped in and suggested that my "Devil's Advocacy" would help us look at the areas we could work on to bring our local section up to the other's level.
Good for your boss, and for you!

That is possibly the most important role for a Devil's Advocate.
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Old 2021-04-23, 17:23   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaurV View Post
That goes for us all. I don't think is related to MS-Dos or Windows. It is called "aging". Here being a DOS/Windows user and programmer for close to 40 years, making a living of it, and had some Linux courses in the Uni (2 semesters, actually, that was like 35 years ago too), and never used it for more than trifles ever since, and I still suck at it. And I am not afraid, neither ashamed to say it. Our force, as a group, stays in the fact that we are different. Some excel in domains where others suck, and vice-versa. And we can help each-other, if we have a positive attitude about it.
40 years. I salute you for your dedication. "Aging" is spot-on. There is another word that works as well, experience. We tend to go, or fall back on, what we know best. We use these things without giving them much though because we are used to them. Leaning anything new takes repetition and exposure. At my age, it is tiresome and tedious. It is much easier to pick up the little details as they come along based on something I have already learned the majority of over time.

I consider the majority of my programming skills as being with "antique" languages. BASIC, COBOL, Pascal, ANSI C, and Assembly. These were the things I was taught in trade-school in the late 1980's and early 1990's. My most recent attempt was with Perl two years ago. I was able to write some meaningful code, but I did not stay with it. Now, I recognize it when I see it, but not much more. The "C" style languages simply sail over my head.

It is true that some excel in areas where others do not. The reverse also applies. Somewhere in all of this, there is a balance, meaning everyone can contribute based on what they have learned over the years. I try.
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Old 2021-04-24, 03:55   #9
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Originally Posted by xilman View Post
Something I learned many years ago: take note of your opponents' arguments.
We would say, in our language, "if you can not convince them, confuse them!"

Last fiddled with by LaurV on 2021-04-24 at 03:55
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Old 2021-04-24, 08:12   #10
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Originally Posted by storm5510 View Post
The "C" style languages simply sail over my head.
It might be worth giving them a second look.
University students who find it difficult typically stumble over things like pointers
- but as you're familiar with assembly programming that won't be a problem
(they're just addresses). My experience of Pascal was that it was more awkward
to use than C, with so many extra (and unnecessary) rules.
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Old 2021-04-24, 09:09   #11
xilman
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My most recent attempt was with Perl two years ago. I was able to write some meaningful code, but I did not stay with it.
That was exactly my relationship with Perl in the mid- to late-90's. Took me about 5-10 years to become fluent in the language.

It is now by far my favourite programming language.

Stick with it, in other words, and don't require that you gain instant comprehension.
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