Ukraine cries. Everyone is lying. UN expresses 'deep concerns'

[LaurV]

Originally Posted by Batalov

listen to Lavrov

to him I was referring in this post when I said "stupid drunk pig they have as a foreign minister".

[Dr Sardonicus]

Originally Posted by xilman

Another plausible scenario. Which countries have a grievance against both Russia and Germany, and have the technical ability to carry out such an act of sabotage?

There is one very obvious candidate and several minor players.

It seems that Russia has abandoned its earlier claim that the good ol' USA is to blame for blowing up the Nord Stream pipelines. Now they're claiming (without any evidence) that the UK's Royal Navy did it.

[Batalov]

Originally Posted by Dr Sardonicus

It seems that Russia has abandoned its earlier claim that the good ol' USA is to blame for blowing up the Nord Stream pipelines. Now they're claiming (without any evidence) that the UK's Royal Navy did it.

Similarly --

Originally Posted by Reuters

UNITED NATIONS, Oct 27 (Reuters) - The United States and allies slammed Russia on Thursday for wasting the time of the U.N. Security Council and spreading conspiracies by again raising its accusation that the United States has "military biological programs" in Ukraine.

"How much more of this nonsense do we have to endure?" Britain's U.N. Ambassador Barbara Woodward asked the council.

Russia has previously raised at least twice at the Security Council the issue of biological weapons programs in Ukraine. The United States and Ukraine have said they do not have biological weapons programs.

...
"Do you really think that we're that naive?" Russia's U.N. Ambassador Vassily Nebenzia told the council as he argued for a commission to investigate the biological weapons claims.

"Do you really think that we think that the Pentagon is going to inform the high representative of the Office of Disarmament Affairs within the U.N. about their secret biological programs in Ukraine?" he said.

Vassily Nebenzia has perfected the infamous question "When Did You Stop Beating Your Wife?"
"Do you really think that we're that naive? (to believe that you stopped beating your wife)"
"Do you really think that we think that the Pentagon is ..." going to tell us honestly that they have stopped beating their wives? (and so on)

It appears that their official policy is to create as much noise as possible so that its discussion will take all time in the world - instead of discussing actual issues.

They've most recently done the same with the trumped up charges of a "dirty bomb". Done with "dirty bomb"? -- immediately launch the next discussion of "U.S. military biological programs in Ukraine."

They did exactly the same for years with the MH-17 affair, throwing around hundreds of self-contradicting theories with a simple purpose - create information fatigue in any given common man and summarize it with "there is no way to know the truth" or "pick any of these to believe in". Common people are doing exactly that; they pick any random nonsense and "believe" in it. They chose not to know, but to believe.
"This and that has been said on TV, so it must be the truth."

[chalsall]

Originally Posted by Batalov

Similarly -- Vassily Nebenzia has perfected the infamous question "When Did You Stop Beating Your Wife?"

Clever logic.

Originally Posted by Batalov

It appears that their official policy is to create as much noise as possible...

That's everyone's official policy. And "Special Ops".

Originally Posted by Batalov

I don't like being told what I know.

But I have reason to believe that you et al /might/ know what is going on here.

Trivial to manage.

And they say we're insane.

While we get shit done...

[Dr Sardonicus]

Originally Posted by Batalov

<snip>
It appears that their official policy is to create as much noise as possible so that its discussion will take all time in the world - instead of discussing actual issues.

They've most recently done the same with the trumped up charges of a "dirty bomb". Done with "dirty bomb"? -- immediately launch the next discussion of "U.S. military biological programs in Ukraine."
<snip>

Russia halts grain deal after 'massive' Black Sea Fleet attack

Russia has announced it is suspending its involvement in the internationally-brokered deal that allows Ukraine to export grain from its Black Sea ports.

It comes after Russia accused Ukraine of a "massive" drone attack on the Black Sea Fleet in Sevastopol, Crimea.

Ukraine has not admitted the attack and President Volodymyr Zelensky called the Russian move "rather predictable".

Without providing evidence, Russia also accused British troops of being involved in Saturday's attack.
<snip>

Some reports say the Admiral Makarov, flagship of Russia's Black Sea fleet, was hit. The Admiral Grigorovich-class frigate became the flagship of Russia's Black Sea fleet after the Moskva was promoted to submarine.

[kriesel]

Truth is the first casualty of war, or, "special military operations".

[Dr Sardonicus]

A quotation from Jonathan Swift in this post, and given in greater scope in this post, may also be apt.

So, the Russians are blaming the UK, a month after blaming the US for their own sabotage of the Nord Stream pipelines. And have replaced "Nazis" with "Satanists" as their label for the people of Ukraine, to account for their otherwise unaccountable resistance to joining with their "brothers."

Perhaps Vlad the Insane will start a "Scapegoat of the Month" club. Who or what will he blame next for his country's latest misdeeds, or the latest calamity in his Special Military Disaster in Ukraine? One thing for sure - it won't be himself!

[xilman]

Originally Posted by LaurV

If Ukrainians did the bridge, this was a mistake. That bridge is more valuable for them alive than dead. If you ask me who did it, I would say, the Russians. I know, you will say I am always the "contra"-man. You asked me who did the pipes, and I told you I don't believe Russians did it, when the "analysts" said otherwise. Now if you ask me who did the bridge, I would say the Russians. I know, nobody asks me. But that bridge is more valuable for Ukrainians intact, than broken. And Russians were looking for a while for an excuse to bomb those cities...
Look to the damage: there is none. The bridge is still functional. And what that train was doing there for almost 3 hours? (trains never stop on bridges, in fact they are required to pass fast...). I think it was a shield. Everything well controlled. Constipation theory...

Originally Posted by https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-november-9

Damage to the Kerch Strait Bridge continues to disrupt Russian ground lines of communication (GLOCs) to southern Ukraine. The United Kingdom Ministry of Defense (MoD) assessed that the Kerch Strait Bridge is unlikely to be operational until at least September 2023, reducing Russia’s ability to move military equipment and personnel by rail and road. The UK MoD noted that, although Russian officials hope to reopen the bridge by March 2023, weather will play a significant role in completing the repairs on time.[63] Mariupol Mayoral Advisor Petro Andryushchenko reported that Russian forces are moving columns of fuel takers to supply Russian positions on the left (east) bank of Dnipro River in Kherson Oblast through Mariupol due to the damages to the Kerch Strait Bridge.[64] Disrupted logistics via the Kerch Strait Bridge also likely contributed to Russia’s decision to withdraw forces from the west bank of Kherson Oblast.

Note the Russians themselves state that reopening the bridge will take months.

[Dr Sardonicus]

There have been reports for days about the Russians looting the city of Kherson; in particular, the Oleksiy Shovkunenko Kherson Art Museum. That reminded me of a 1960's war movie, The Train.

This will be big news, if it turns out to be true. Ukraine is publicly cautious. Kherson: Russia to withdraw troops from key Ukrainian city

Russia's military has been ordered to pull out of the Ukrainian city of Kherson, the only regional capital it captured after invading in February.

Russia's commander in Ukraine, Gen Sergei Surovikin, said it was no longer possible to keep supplying the city.

The withdrawal means Russian forces will pull out entirely from the western bank of the River Dnipro.

It is a significant blow as Russia faces a Ukrainian counter-offensive.

The military's top brass announced the decision on Russian state TV, with Gen Surovikin reporting on the situation on the ground in Kherson.

President Vladimir Putin did not take part in the staged event. The architect of Russia's failing war in Ukraine appeared to have left the announcement to his generals.

EDIT: I noticed this after posting. According to The Daily Mail (and other sources)

The order for Russian troops to abandon the city came just hours after the Russian-installed 'deputy head' of the Kherson region was killed in a car crash.

The regional governor's press service confirmed that Kirill Stremousov, 45, died when his Lexus was involved in a collision with a truck.
<snip>
The 45-year-old, who was appointed two months after the invasion of Ukraine, was wanted in Kyiv for treason.
<snip>

[LaurV]

Originally Posted by xilman

Note the Russians themselves state that reopening the bridge will take months.

Note that one train line is and was always operational, and nobody says anything about it. And the cars never stopped coming and going. If russians themselves destroyed it (I said "if"), as a reason to shell ukrainean cities, what would you think they would say? That there is no damage?

[ldesnogu]

Originally Posted by LaurV

Note that one train line is and was always operational, and nobody says anything about it.

Yeah sure traffic operates as usual on the bridge