mersenneforum.org  

Go Back   mersenneforum.org > Extra Stuff > Blogorrhea > jvang

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2018-10-26, 13:35   #23
Uncwilly
6809 > 6502
 
Uncwilly's Avatar
 
"""""""""""""""""""
Aug 2003
101×103 Posts

97·103 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by henryzz View Post
I don't know what it is like in the US but when I was at uni in the UK any computer work was done in a computer lab.
In the past 3 years I have been involved in a project with a uni computer dept. All of the work was being done on the students' laptops (even most of the work dealing with android programming.) Not only on the project I was involved with, but the other students as well (I visited the campus often).
Uncwilly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2018-10-26, 14:08   #24
jvang
veganjoy
 
jvang's Avatar
 
"Joey"
Nov 2015
Middle of Nowhere,AR

22·3·37 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by M344587487 View Post
They really don't. It's all about how thin and crippled by thermals they can make something now. Unless you go for a specialist laptop or maybe the most popular brands I don't think you'll be able to replace the cooler, at best you can replace the paste. It wouldn't be a good idea to use liquid metal even though that would be the most beneficial.
However convenient as thin laptops look, I'm trying to avoid those (at least ones that are obviously thermally handicapped). And this whole "liquid metal" thing is new to me, what's special about it in comparison to typical paste? I thought the purpose of thermal paste was to fill in irregularities in the CPU/motherboard interface, not to create a new one. But maybe I'm understanding something wrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pinhodecarlos View Post
So what degree are you taking? Can you post the list of courses. Just want to understand if you really need a fancy laptop.
Currently going in with Computer Engineering, but the 1st/2nd years are general engineering courses that would all transfer if I were to switch to a different engineering major. Here's a big list of the courses, with their catalog descriptions: http://catalog.uark.edu/undergraduat...ngineeringtext

I think this is the same thing, but maybe easier to read: http://catalog.uark.edu/plangrids/co...eering_bscmpe/

I'm not sure what software/programs I'd be running, but I'm assuming CAD is a basic skill for engineering, given that I've used it in high school intro-to-engineering classes. Unfortunately, the class computers we had to use with that software were very slow

Quote:
Originally Posted by henryzz View Post
I don't know what it is like in the US but when I was at uni in the UK any computer work was done in a computer lab. You should be able to learn this sort of thing from an open day/emailing relevant people. I would confirm this before buying.
There are computer labs, but they are strictly computer labs and we won't have class in them. Here's a snippet from one of their websites:

http://uofastore.com/computer/tech-guide/#department

Quote:
College of Engineering
Recommended computers

Windows is recommended for engineering students because some degrees will require the use of CAD programs. If running Windows on a Mac, click here for details. Each department may have specific hardware recommendations for incoming students. Please check with your future department to verify needs.
Civil, Electrical, CSCE, Industrial, Biomedical
» Apple or Dell that meets general recommendations.

Chemical, Mechanical
» 2.5GHz+ Intel Core i5 or better, 8GB+ RAM, 250GB+ Storage, Windows 7 or higher 64-bit
Unfortunately computer engineering isn't listed here?

Hm, some browsing tells me that the university requires everyone to install Symantec Antivirus if you want to use the on-campus WiFi. Hopefully Symantec isn't awful or something...

Last fiddled with by jvang on 2018-10-26 at 14:11 Reason: typing is hard
jvang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2018-10-26, 14:18   #25
jvang
veganjoy
 
jvang's Avatar
 
"Joey"
Nov 2015
Middle of Nowhere,AR

22×3×37 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncwilly View Post
In the past 3 years I have been involved in a project with a uni computer dept. All of the work was being done on the students' laptops (even most of the work dealing with android programming.) Not only on the project I was involved with, but the other students as well (I visited the campus often).
Can you elaborate on what the project was, and were there students without laptops?

On a side note, if I were to go into the architecture program at the University of Arkansas, it seems that they recommend a very professional mobile workstation that costs $2000!

https://archlabs.uark.edu/computer-specifications-3/

According to another page on the architecture website, the alternative seems to be buying a stationary workstation cabinet. Good thing I'm going with engineering!
jvang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2018-10-26, 14:32   #26
pinhodecarlos
 
pinhodecarlos's Avatar
 
"Carlos Pinho"
Oct 2011
Milton Keynes, UK

10011011010112 Posts
Default

Basically you only need a laptop for your programming foundation courses, but as David mentioned before you can use university computers at labs or dedicated rooms. The rest is done by hand and brain.

Last fiddled with by pinhodecarlos on 2018-10-26 at 14:33
pinhodecarlos is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2018-10-26, 15:15   #27
CRGreathouse
 
CRGreathouse's Avatar
 
Aug 2006

3·1,993 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jvang View Post
If I feel that something similar to a Mac was worth buying, I'd buy a Surface or something, despite how awful Microsoft is.
The new Microsoft isn't that bad. The Surface... I'd pass, unless you have the cash for the Pro line (which is definitely on the premium side, which I don't recommend for college student types).

Quote:
Originally Posted by jvang View Post
This makes sense, but what's wrong with Seagate? And having double physical backups in different locations (locked in a safe?!) plus online backups seems pretty paranoid

What would be a good option for an external backup drive? Are there special ones with fancy security features I should pay attention to (or the lack of such security in a product)?
Having no backups means you are guaranteed to lose your data, it's just a matter of how long until that happens.

Having one backup means you have a window of vulnerability that opens as soon as either of your drives fails. If the drive isn't monitoring itself for failures, it could fail silently, which means the window of vulnerability is open-ended... putting you in the above position.

Having two backups means that if one fails, you're still backed up. As long as you have two backups, monitoring for failures, and the ability to replace drives substantially faster than expected failure time, you should be good.

Online backups let you get around the levels (the storage provider has sufficiently many levels of backup already) but introduces a new point of failure, network outage; so a local backup and a cloud backup seems to work well in tandem. It also serves well to mitigate against nonpayment (oops, CC expired) or backup provider going out of business unexpectedly.

So I wouldn't class it as paranoia, really, but reasonable caution. YMMV. If you have very little of value on the machine there are lower-cost options available.
CRGreathouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2018-10-26, 15:42   #28
paulunderwood
 
paulunderwood's Avatar
 
Sep 2002
Database er0rr

3,851 Posts
Default

This old post has a link on how to implement a roll-your-own automatic backup system:

https://www.mersenneforum.org/showthread.php?t=5089

Last fiddled with by paulunderwood on 2018-10-26 at 15:50
paulunderwood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2018-10-26, 15:45   #29
Nick
 
Nick's Avatar
 
Dec 2012
The Netherlands

110110011002 Posts
Default

A serious computer engineer doesn't just use a computer as a piece of office equipment but also as a piece of lab equipment.
That means spending time with the lid off and a soldering iron in your hand...

You may also want to reserve some money for a good quality oscilloscope to attach to your computer.
Nick is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 2018-10-26, 17:43   #30
M344587487
 
M344587487's Avatar
 
"Composite as Heck"
Oct 2017

2×3×11×13 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jvang View Post
However convenient as thin laptops look, I'm trying to avoid those (at least ones that are obviously thermally handicapped). And this whole "liquid metal" thing is new to me, what's special about it in comparison to typical paste? I thought the purpose of thermal paste was to fill in irregularities in the CPU/motherboard interface, not to create a new one. But maybe I'm understanding something wrong?
Liquid metal is more thermally conductive than paste but it's also electrically conductive and a pain to install not least because you should insulate the components around the die in case the liquid metal shifts. People normally use liquid metal in delidded desktop CPUs but it's also reasonably popular in laptops as thermals matter just as much there (as a side note laptop CPUs do not use an IHS so you need to be a bit more careful than you might be used to with a desktop). You'll be moving the laptop often enough that the risk associated with liquid metal is high enough to not bother with IMO, a sharp jolt could be enough to displace it and spoil your day. Just use a high quality non-conductive thermal paste instead.
M344587487 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2018-10-26, 18:45   #31
Uncwilly
6809 > 6502
 
Uncwilly's Avatar
 
"""""""""""""""""""
Aug 2003
101×103 Posts

97×103 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jvang View Post
Can you elaborate on what the project was, and were there students without laptops?
Multiple local uni's have set-up programs where seniors in various technical fields (like mechanical and civil engineering and comp sci) get real world issues to work on. Government, private industry, and non-profits (sometimes the school itself) have projects that they want accomplished. They provide the school money to help support the departments (help pay the prof, etc.). They get their jobs done and often hire the students right out of school.

Past projects that I know about:
Flood control and water retention engineering for the local county.
Work for NASA dealing with data management and distribution.
Work with NASA on processing data from the moon and Mars to automate things so people don't have to eyeball things.
Work for AT&T / DirectTV with regards to satellite uplink/downlink system reliability and maint.
County library system image processing (from their vast archives) to allow these hidden gems to be accessed meaningfully my patrons of their website.
Overhauling a private/public school's website to make it a useful portal for parents, admin, teachers, etc.
Developing solar powered USB charging stations to be placed into the uni's outdoor tables scattered around campus.
Local government fleet tracking (not real time), with trip tracking, submittal, and authorization website. This included building hardware (for between $60-150 a unit), having the system pass vehicle error codes to fleet garage staff.
The project that I was involved with is a system developing a custom android app and web interface to handle our data needs.

If you want more, PM/DM me and I can point you to the school's website for the program and give you more details about my involvement.

All of the comp sci students always had their laptops with them. At times during our meetings they fixed code on the fly, demoed the app via an android emulator to get feedback, etc. They used github for code management and bug/issue tracking.

At the end of the year they have to get up and present their project to a large group (it is an event that lasts several hours). The liasons from the sponsors show up and all of the different teams. There are so many teams that four or more sessions run at the same time in different rooms.
Uncwilly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2018-10-26, 22:58   #32
jvang
veganjoy
 
jvang's Avatar
 
"Joey"
Nov 2015
Middle of Nowhere,AR

1101111002 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by paulunderwood View Post
This old post has a link on how to implement a roll-your-own automatic backup system:

https://www.mersenneforum.org/showthread.php?t=5089
An old post indeed! But I probably won't run Linux on my personal computers because of compatibility and familiarity

Quote:
Originally Posted by M344587487 View Post
Liquid metal is more thermally conductive than paste but it's also electrically conductive and a pain to install not least because you should insulate the components around the die in case the liquid metal shifts. People normally use liquid metal in delidded desktop CPUs but it's also reasonably popular in laptops as thermals matter just as much there (as a side note laptop CPUs do not use an IHS so you need to be a bit more careful than you might be used to with a desktop). You'll be moving the laptop often enough that the risk associated with liquid metal is high enough to not bother with IMO, a sharp jolt could be enough to displace it and spoil your day. Just use a high quality non-conductive thermal paste instead.
So... is it actually straight up liquid, held in place by cohesion/adhesion forces only? How does anyone get it to stay put inside a laptop?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncwilly View Post
Multiple local uni's have set-up programs where seniors in various technical fields (like mechanical and civil engineering and comp sci) get real world issues to work on. Government, private industry, and non-profits (sometimes the school itself) have projects that they want accomplished. They provide the school money to help support the departments (help pay the prof, etc.). They get their jobs done and often hire the students right out of school.

Past projects that I know about:
Flood control and water retention engineering for the local county.
Work for NASA dealing with data management and distribution.
Work with NASA on processing data from the moon and Mars to automate things so people don't have to eyeball things.
Work for AT&T / DirectTV with regards to satellite uplink/downlink system reliability and maint.
County library system image processing (from their vast archives) to allow these hidden gems to be accessed meaningfully my patrons of their website.
Overhauling a private/public school's website to make it a useful portal for parents, admin, teachers, etc.
Developing solar powered USB charging stations to be placed into the uni's outdoor tables scattered around campus.
Local government fleet tracking (not real time), with trip tracking, submittal, and authorization website. This included building hardware (for between $60-150 a unit), having the system pass vehicle error codes to fleet garage staff.
The project that I was involved with is a system developing a custom android app and web interface to handle our data needs.

If you want more, PM/DM me and I can point you to the school's website for the program and give you more details about my involvement.

All of the comp sci students always had their laptops with them. At times during our meetings they fixed code on the fly, demoed the app via an android emulator to get feedback, etc. They used github for code management and bug/issue tracking.

At the end of the year they have to get up and present their project to a large group (it is an event that lasts several hours). The liasons from the sponsors show up and all of the different teams. There are so many teams that four or more sessions run at the same time in different rooms.
Wow, that sounds intense! Seems very challenging, is it part of an honors degree/program or something?
jvang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2018-10-27, 01:23   #33
CRGreathouse
 
CRGreathouse's Avatar
 
Aug 2006

175B16 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jvang View Post
An old post indeed! But I probably won't run Linux on my personal computers because of compatibility and familiarity
If you want to go into computer engineering, you should learn to work with linux -- and not just linux, but command-line linux. It will go easier if your main computer is a linux machine, or at least as a second boot option. But it's your call.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jvang View Post
So... is it actually straight up liquid, held in place by cohesion/adhesion forces only? How does anyone get it to stay put inside a laptop?
It's a paste, but when it gets hot it can act funny I guess. In general it's pretty touchy, I wouldn't recommend using it until you get some experience. Great thermal characteristics, but that's worth nothing if it eats through your aluminum....
CRGreathouse is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Processor stuck at 25% when multithreading GaEL YAFU 18 2015-12-31 10:08
Most-lucrative college degrees all involve math cheesehead Lounge 4 2010-04-11 17:44
laptop victorvicentim Information & Answers 2 2009-09-01 00:20
What (general) advice would you give me about college? jasong jasong 6 2006-11-19 15:38
Laptop CPU ndpowell Hardware 1 2005-07-07 21:10

All times are UTC. The time now is 09:08.


Sat Oct 16 09:08:28 UTC 2021 up 85 days, 3:37, 0 users, load averages: 0.50, 0.87, 0.93

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum has received and complied with 0 (zero) government requests for information.

Permission is granted to copy, distribute and/or modify this document under the terms of the GNU Free Documentation License, Version 1.2 or any later version published by the Free Software Foundation.
A copy of the license is included in the FAQ.